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Dingbat32 says...

@ThinkingGame, fair response to your post which was intended to wind up.

I have heard this statement about TMO not being able to rule on stuff in the build up to the try. Is this actually correct? Thinking in particular of Mark Cueto in WC final 2003. TMO made that call didn't he and it was all to do with the foot being out prior to it coming back in for grounding? Is this not the purpose of "is there any reason why I cant award the try?".

I agree that Scotland errors led to the loss, altough disagree on the the discipline issue completely. If anything Scotland need a bit of an enforcer in the Nallet/Botha/Thorn mould to help them stand up to the likes of the eternally overated Wales. That and a few decisions from the ref going their way would do wonders for their confidence.

It is all very well sticking up for the refs, and I understand that they have a hard job, but the mistakes should even out. At the moment they dont, and the weaker team seems to get a harder time of it.

Posted 12:01 20th February 2012

ThinkingGame says...

@Dingbat32

@ThinkingGame - Yes! and sympathies to your parents!

That was the graceless bit. The TMO can only rule on the grounding, not a knock on in the build up. If there had been a clear knock on, and the ref had missed it, and asked the TMO to rule on the try, it would have been awarded. Here, the ref thought he saw a knock on, and blew his whistle. It was not poor refereeing, since it was tough to see either way even on the replay. The referee was consistent in his interpretation and application of the Laws. He made a number of understandable errors that is entirely in context with other refereeing displays at this level. The reason Scotland lost is that they lost their discipline under pressure, and were playing a better side.

Posted 14:58 14th February 2012

Dingbat32 says...

melkdave,

In real time it looked like Cueto scored a try in the final of the 2007 World Cup! But he didnt, and South Africa won. That is what the TMO is for. Can the ref/touch judge honestly say they were quick enough to get a view on what was happening, or were they behind Hogg?

I agree that refs go to TMO too often, but they need to get this judgement right. Maybe each team allowed to request 1/2 reviews per game?

Posted 10:02 14th February 2012

melkdave says...

Poilet was a bit weak imo refering the the breakdown and yes Wales did take advantage espically Adam Jones who lay over the ball or in the way a couple of times imo Also Walsh players where a tad slow in getting up off the floor and usually blocked the scrum halfs pass to the back line.when they did If Scotland had been as cynical as M.Phillips in catching Rennie well at least 2 penalties went begging there .All in all Scotland could have gone in at half time 15-3 up imo As to the disallowed try well come on in real time it looked a blatant knock on only in super slow motion do you see it isnt .Can you imagine the screams for his head if he allowed a try from what looked like a certain knock on if the slow motion had showed it was LOL.I applaurd him for actually making a call with out refering it to a TMO atm referees are being gutless in even refering easy certain tries to the TMOs If they arnt going to make decisions why the hell have them .TMOs are supposed to be used when the decision is unclear like the R.Jones maybe try against Ireland not for clear cut decisions.atm it seems every try is refered to the TMO and thats wrong and shows how scared / gutless referees have become of making a decision

Posted 16:32 13th February 2012

Dingbat32 says...

@ThinkingGame

Neutral for this one and how am I graceless when I have pointed out Scotland lack of killer instinct and said I dont think they would have won the game?

That does not change the bad calls made by the ref, one of which was definitely a major controversy because he should have checked propely with TV official.

Whilst the result might not have changed, a smaller gap in the scores would have made for an even better game.

Posted 14:28 13th February 2012

ThinkingGame says...

@Dingbat32

Graceless. An engaging game of rugby happened, without major controversy, and Scotland were well beaten.

Posted 13:18 13th February 2012

Dingbat32 says...

7ton - good point

Posted 12:46 13th February 2012

7ton says...

Suilven

The headline from PR here is a bit misleading

I watched the interview with Lydiate and he was just responding to a leading question from the interviewer in a polite way. He was not in anyway telling or lecturing Scotland about disipline but just going along with the interviewer

Posted 10:44 13th February 2012

Dingbat32 says...

@jontheref - I never said Scotland would have won, I pointed out that Lydiate has a cheek blaming Scottish indiscipline when Wales had a large helping hand from the ref. Dont care what it says on "other thread" - the ref should have looked at it properly because there is no way he could have seen it without help from TV official.

@ThinkingGame - Yes! and sympathies to your parents!

Posted 10:38 13th February 2012

suilven says...

@jontheref I think you're a wee bit confused as to which match & what we're talking about...You're not George Clancy are you?

Posted 10:34 13th February 2012

jontheref says...

dingbat,

Read the other thread, no try, knock on before the pick up.

As the scottish try, (after more than 6 hours of trying!), was from the same piece of pressure, if given, it would not have altered the scoreline,in fact the conversion may have been missed!

Posted 07:28 13th February 2012

ThinkingGame says...

@Dingbat32

No. And my sympathies.

Posted 02:48 13th February 2012

suilven says...

Isn't it nice of Mr Lydiate to tell us about our "indiscipline"? Wales of course being"squeaky clean" & never, ever doing anything meriting a yellow card, let alone a red.

Thank you Dingbat32, yup, we saw that deliberate knock on too. & Sean Lamont being taken out off the ball earlier & ... &... but no, it was our indiscipline!

Posted 23:30 12th February 2012

Dingbat32 says...

Just prior to Scotlands first yellow card, I am pretty sure I saw Wales deliberately knock on to stop a Scotland move. A yellow card offence.

Wales had hands in every ruck, yet no yellow.

Scotland had a legitimate try disallowed.

Yes Scotland had the usual lack of killer instinct, but it would be more fair to blame poor referee (again!) rather than lack of discipline.

Posted 22:37 12th February 2012

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